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Foreign tradition/religion vs Valentines Day
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by
 
on 2008-02-14 05:29:14 (edited 2008-02-14 05:29:40)
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Days before Valentines Day, I read this one article--- In Saudi Arabia, the officials have already put a ban on red roses, to warn their citizens that Valentines Day is the time where some couples may form 'immoral' relationships. That's their only reason. Another one is from one of the strict regions in India, where religious people of their religion burned lots of Valentines Day items in the bonfire every 14th February. Their reason is this celebration brings forth Western influences to their citizens. In my opinion, both reasons are truly offensive. They simply show no respect for the culture and tradition preserved within this celebration! You don't have to be a Christian to celebrate this, obviously. In this day, we should not see love as a materialistic thing. This is the day where love is around us. Doesn't matter that you don't have a date, you can get this warm, lovely atmosphere within the environment. Everybody wants that comfortable ambience... nobody wants to tread upon war-torn land because of unacceptance culture. What do you think? |
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Re: Foreign tradition/religion vs Valentines Day
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on 2008-02-14 05:48:48 (edited 2008-02-14 05:51:08)
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offensive or not that their tradition, even if it clash on another, that simply the way they think, and thought, for example, lately, no just now, in my country they said that valentine day is like saudi said immoral, but then what, do people listen, the one that said that valentine day immoral is one of group, so the other not think that so right. um... it's confusing, okay here it is, valentines day although some people said that (the topic), some don't and some understand that valentine day is day of love, when we show our love to one another, so if the other think it's not well they have something in their mind, the reason that is not, say that what saudi said because when the people celebrate valentines day some teenagers do something indecent and that what cause them to misjudge and prejudice, or we take a look on historical view of india, they being slave by western, it is not by the religion or whatsoever, there must be something that scar the society and makes them to reject something, influence, or new way in this case their history, their way of thinking, and religion is one of the factor, but religion is the shield, a strong one that will provide them right in their cause 
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Re: Foreign tradition/religion vs Valentines Day
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Oh wow, wow, minna-san! Listen, I'm from India, and that's my country you people are talking about! @Key: You've got a mistaken view about us, Key-san! India, though it was a slave of Britain for 200 years, is now free, and has every right to pick which cultures it should accept and which it should reject. It decided to keep English, and has decided to discard the sheer profit motive behind it's institutions. Valentine's day is not a part of our culture, and wasn't so until in the early 1990s when the Archies company came here. To generate a handsome profit from the sales of its (overpriced, low-quality) goods, it decided to introduce the tradition of Valentine's Day into India. So, for merely commercial reasons, we must forcibly obey an alien festival (This raises an interesting question for w00t0s-san: Don't you think we have the right to choose what we respect?). Now I won't attempt to defend the bigots who do the things you guys mention, but what about our national identity? India is facing a grave crisis because its younger citizens (like me) are now looking to the West in terms of culture, instead of cherishing their own. I have no objection to V-Day being celebrated, but I do believe that it should free to us to decide whether we want to adopt it into our culture.  --> |
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Re: Foreign tradition/religion vs Valentines Day
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on 2008-02-14 07:20:25 |
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@gant ah, so then it come to what i said, well not the history because i'm wrong, it's about the scar, the culture got rejected because of scar by that certain culture but gant i must say that right now india is really running to be big in global economy, i've seen CNBC or kind of that that interview india CEO and all that, if i'm from india i'll be proud of it, but still the national tradition is in the question again ^^
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Re: Foreign tradition/religion vs Valentines Day
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on 2008-02-14 10:40:11 |
Honestly I'm a American and even I hate V-Day. I don't care what people do. If they burn down plastic hearts, fine with me. V-Day is all about money and false love mostly.  
"It's better to be used, then to be useless." |
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Re: Foreign tradition/religion vs Valentines Day
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on 2008-02-14 11:41:56 (edited 2008-02-20 05:31:04)
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@gant- I do understand your feelings, and I don't need to know where you came from whatsoever. But can't you see your people were acting over the top? Why burning all the Valentines Day stuffs? (That is not environmentally-friendly) Why can't they just ignore them? Why can't they just pretend it's just an ordinary day? I have no problem that they (and you) prefer to respect their own culture. Of course it's important for the younger generations to follow and cherish the country's traditions, absolutely! But they need to educate themselves to Western stuffs too--- not all things from the West are bad! Indian medic students study overseas not only to get the qualification, they also need to understand the culture of that country they currently reside, as a means of gaining knowledge and widens their understanding on human behaviour over certain norms, that they can learn from them, possibly can improve their morale and conduct and logical thinking too. These students will always remember where they come from, how strong they cherish their traditions and customs and culture, but never put forth pride. How about the Indians who live in that strict region in India? Why are they behaving badly over this day? Why? Sure it's a Western thing, and they do not get used to it, but what they did is simply over the top, disrespectful to those who celebrates Valentines Day and even those who appreciates that day. Do you want foreign people to carry their bad impression over your people? Absolutely not. |
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Re: Foreign tradition/religion vs Valentines Day
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| For me Vday is universal. maybe the history of the dark vday is right, but ppl's perception about vday now ish different. for me vday ish the day we can express our love to the ppl specially by giving them gifts~ |
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Re: Foreign tradition/religion vs Valentines Day
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on 2008-02-14 22:53:35 |
To be truthful, i can actually support the Indian logic for Anti-Valentine's day sentiments, there has been significant Westernisation in that nation, and that some citizens wish to protest it in such a matter seems to be alright based off my belief in freedom of expression, maybe in commendable for trying to preserve their traditional culture.  |
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Re: Foreign tradition/religion vs Valentines Day
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on 2008-02-15 02:35:11 |
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^ It's that kind of view that they then use to justify blowing themselves up in crowded places killing many innocent people. (if anyone wants to counter argue me on that, I'm a soldier and I know what I've seen and what I'm talking about...) I say people should keep their culture to themselves, but they shouldn't go around with such destructive fervor in order to 'preserve' it. The fact is all these religions and such are fighting for new followers everyday, it's all a big power struggle. It perfectly mirrors corporate business in the modern day. On the whole I think it's just another little destruction mongering tactic used by an out of date medium called religion.  |
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Re: Foreign tradition/religion vs Valentines Day
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| Individual countries have the right and obligation to try and protect their culture, tradition and law. In the examples above, Saudi Arabia legal law runs parallel (if not identical) to Islamic Law. Plus, they like India have been subject to British colonial influences after WWI and likely have residual resentment towards the West because of it. Not to mention other factors like Arab Nationalism are taking place to try and strengthen the Arab identity. And guess what? That doesn’t include Valentines Day. All the rhetoric is just an attempt to act as a counter balance to what is perceived/actual Western peddling in their affairs. |
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Re: Foreign tradition/religion vs Valentines Day
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@w00t0s,key,Damean: You guys are each partially wrong, and partially right. I will attempt to show you how, one by one. w00t0s-san, let me begin by constructing a hypothetical situation. Let's say, a foreign power invades your nation and issues an order stating that all citizens in your country must behave like them;in effect, you must adopt their culture. Would you then, "just pretend it's just an ordinary day"? When your whole national identity is being taken away? This is what it's happening you know. Our national identity is being strangled. No one respects V-Day, w00t0s-san! Half of the people on the street don't even know who St.Valentine was. In the end, it all comes down to aping something that others tell you is good. Key-san, I really must urge you not to attempt a psychological study of India and Indians. Yes, we have had scars from our long period of slavery, but the generation born 1970 onwards was not even in touch with the past. And every influence is not for the good. Is the US' interference in Iraq and a dozen other nations "good"? Should we just nod our heads and say "yes sir no sir" to everything the US says? Should we always open our doors to every "influence", which is really an invasion in disguise? Must we always accept, accept and accept? Damean-san, You really should not bring "residual resentment towards the West" as a reason for India rejecting Valentine's Day. We do not resent the West;in fact,we don't need to,do we? Asia runs the show now. No, I think this is all because Westerners are the ones who resent the East. They are the ones who believe that their culture is at threat. History will give us an example: Europe's greatness began only when the Ottoman invaded!!!! It was only then that the Christians suddenly became really pious and thought of proselytizing. In either case, know that I am not, I repeat, not attempting to defend the bigoted bastards who do these things. But foreigners should know that India is not a Count of Monte Cristo, that swears undying revenge against those who were superior to it at one time. Instead, she has, like every other invader, forgiven the West and moved on. --> |
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Re: Foreign tradition/religion vs Valentines Day
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on 2008-02-17 08:35:38 (edited 2008-02-17 08:39:11)
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| @gant- I would say yeah, I would pretend it's just an ordinary day (no matter what foreign forces had put forth). I don't celebrate Valentines Day, but I appreciate that day. It's not like I am going to be converted into some religion in this modern era, just cuz I like Valentines Day. It's not like St. Valentine gonna bash anyone's heads who has no idea who he was and whatever he did and quoted! You make it sound like this Valentines Day gonna destroy Deepavali, Thaipusam, whatever beautiful Indian ritual celebrations in India. These people cannot be very proud of their country... it makes things sound like this crappy yet empty "The American Dream" quote. What a neurotic hype. |
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Re: Foreign tradition/religion vs Valentines Day
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on 2008-02-17 09:00:51 |
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@gant um... that why i said (well okay then no talk about psychological here) that why i said it because of something that the culuture get rejected or accepted well for me valentine or not it's no different, but there in japan (anime said it all) has accepted the culture to certain degree, it's just the way you look at it, i said valentine day do no harm, but you could say they are. so here you are back to what you said, the acceptance is the key
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Re: Foreign tradition/religion vs Valentines Day
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on 2008-02-18 04:35:35 |
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i dont care much about Valentines but as a Catholic i believe that this day deserves respect... not only that we express love in a special and different way at this day but its also a day comemorating the death of a saint... but if sum people just cant understand the true esence of Valentines then leave them be... they hev their own brains afterall... 
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Re: Foreign tradition/religion vs Valentines Day
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I believe that the reactions from the above mentioned gov'ts were exaggerated. The best way to protect a culture lies on the individual, not on any form of authority. If the individuals can consciously, without the fearing of punishment of a secular authority, choose their own cultural background instead of a foreign one, then there's no need to worry about westernization, like in the case of Saudi Arabia or those states in India. The greatest example of the success of this approach is Judaism. For centuries they lived without a governning body as powerful as a State and they kept most of their traditions that dates back to the days of Moshe. The scattered jewish groups around the world kept most of the times their heritage despite external influences. So despite the catholic origin of V-Day, the materialism and assimilation process related to the event, those individuals won't be influenced by this celebration. In fact, the attitude criticised, in my opinion, reveals the use of religion or traditions for political purposes, in benefit of the ruling group, not on preservation of local heritage from foreign influence. |
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Re: Foreign tradition/religion vs Valentines Day
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on 2008-02-20 05:33:56 (edited 2008-02-20 05:34:38)
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| @Sam- That's so true... |
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Re: Foreign tradition/religion vs Valentines Day
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on 2008-02-21 02:39:14 |
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Heh, gotta say, sam you put up a good argument there. But there has always been some fear of an opposing elemt, that's what draws seperate groups together. Whether they are a peaceful group or not, does not stop them being pushed over the edge by the right nudge at the vital point. Look at the persecution of the Jews for example. They hadn't done anything to anyone and they were attacked because they decided to openly preach their faith. Was it damaging anyone? No. Was it fair? No, definitely not. It all depends, at the end of the day, you can't call a group either good or bad, it depends on the individual and sometimes it only takes one to cause the others to follow. Just like a flock of pidgeons. |
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Re: Foreign tradition/religion vs Valentines Day
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wow gant. I wholeheartedly agree with you. but wow...I didn't even know Vday was a religious holiday...and I'm catholic. =_= @ renshi_sho: It's not necessarily the government sending people off to blow themselves up and whatnot for their religion, it's the extremists. I disagree with you that people should keep their culture to themselves, but rather, share it (without the intent of profit).as for the burning of vday cards and whatnot, it's not really harming anybody (except for the environment). Some people go around burning the american flag, for obvious reasons. It's their right. leave 'em be. they don't want to celebrate vday, so be it. But I do agree that religions tend to go over the top. remember the crusaders? janissaries? muslim warriors (jihad, I think?) If people go so far as to actually harm another individual in the process to preserve their faith/culture, then that's where I'd draw the line. 
wooo maplestory |
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Re: Foreign tradition/religion vs Valentines Day
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on 2008-02-24 10:45:17 (edited 2008-02-24 10:45:57)
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| @raystorm- I don't see Valentines Day as a religious holiday, it's just a special day that fills with love, really. But most things you have said there, I agree, anyway. (btw, muslim warriors can be called as 'moors', but i think that's outdated >_< jihad is an arab word, meaning 'struggle'. Some call them 'jihad soldiers' though, but actually that term is wrong TT__TT) |
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Re: Foreign tradition/religion vs Valentines Day
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on 2008-12-09 07:13:49 |
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I never even knew that valentines day was a catholic tradition. I thought it was just some thing that became a trend that became popular thus it was given a name. I never new Valentino was a persons real name. well if it was catholic most definitely it is not meant to encourage immoral acts since *ehem* before matrimony is also not allowed in catholic religion, though not every body follows that rule. though I like valentines, I never celebrated it though. I like the Japanese's version of valentines best and then comes white day. yeah why would they even bother to burn those valentines cards. it a big hustle just to gathering all those stuff and burn them. not to mention its bad for your lungs and the mess it leaves behind. they could just ignore it like it never happened like w00t0s said. they spent a lot of time just to express their rejection to valentines. |