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So you want to learn Japanese... Link | by on 2006-02-23 08:53:03

Okay, I've been seeing a lot posts in here about people wanting to learn Japanese, and I feel that you need to know what you may be getting yourself into, so here is an essay written by a Japanese major a few years back and has reached a level of fame amongst Japanese students. Its all true. Yes, even that. http://pepper.idge.net/japanese/ If you still want to learn, 頑張って！ --theKiyote "Everything you ever loved will be altered or destroyed"

Re: So you want to learn Japanese... Link | by ｢源｣ on 2006-02-23 09:31:15 (edited 2006-02-23 09:34:12)

Sadly, there probably are quite a bit of truth to it. I don't agree with everything that's written, but hey, the author did intend it to be a bit of joke. I see it more as an exaggeration than joke for the most part. I don't have a point of view of those who learn the Japanese from scratch (it's my first language), but I can see that there is a lot to be said about stereotype and idealism of some students who want to learn the language.

Re: So you want to learn Japanese... Link | by on 2006-02-23 15:53:42 (edited 2006-02-23 15:55:51)

Heh, yea, I know. I started learning Japanese as a freshman in college. I don't think that its just Japanese thats that hard, but rather any second language learned later on in life. What it takes to become fluent usually is nothing short of obsessive studying and drive, especially if you don't have the oportunity to learn it all in the country that its spoken in. I do think that Japanese is hard for Americans because its completely unlike English, and the same goes vice versa. But it seems like it wouild be just as hard for a Japanese student to learn French, or an American to learn Korean or Chinese. Hey, Minamoto, you said you came to the US from Japan, right? Did you go through the school system at all? I'm graduating college soon and am thinking about applying for grad school there, but it might fall through due to inability to get there for the entrance exams. Maybe I'll try to get into a conversation school and then take the exams once I'm there... Well, any advice you could give would be great. --theKiyote "Everything you ever loved will be altered or destroyed"

Re: So you want to learn Japanese... Link | by ｢源｣ on 2006-02-24 05:41:07

The best way to learn any language is to actually live it. It's a painful process in the beginning, but it does pay off. I went through it in English, forcefully... I came to the state when I was in junior high. I didn't go through their high school or college system, but I am quite aware of the toughness. I actually took a junior high entrance exam to a private school. It's kind of like high school or college one, but with only those who really want it, since it's optional. (or parents want it) I can tell you just from that, that it's VERY intense. But unfortunately, I don't have much of information regarding a graduate school. They may have a small bracket for English speakers at certain schools, but I would imagine that the accepted vs. applied ratio is probably very high. But if you have a strong desire, it's probably worth looking into at least. Also I've had a friend who went to Japan to teach English at school for 3 years (starts as 1 year, but she got extension). I don't know what needs to be done to get into something like that.

Re: So you want to learn Japanese... Link | by on 2006-02-24 08:22:51

If your friend got a contract for one year, and was able to extend it for three, she was probably in the JET program, although she might of been with one of the other schools. JET has been getting fairly competitive in the past couple of years, but the private language schools still seem fairly accomodating. Applying for a teaching position in Japan seems to be a fairly standard way of breaking into the business world, at least at my school. Some of the top Japanese schools have pages on graduate programs in English, but they seem to be more geared towards exchange programs where a student comes to Japan to do research for whatever he is working on. If there is any mention at all of an aplication process at all, it tends to just be a reference to the Japanese page, which seems to be just a list of materials that needed to be filled out and due dates. I've tried to ask questions on Japanese boards (most specifically 2ch.net) but since the anti-foreigner feeling runs high there, it usually just evolves into a racial slurring match. I've passed the 2nd level of the Japanese proficiency exam, and am already studying for the first. I've lived in Japan for a year, all be it at a school that probably shelters its foreign exchange students a little too much. I really want to continue on with my education, but also want to return to Japan. This just seems like the best way, though I could be wrong... --theKiyote "Everything you ever loved will be altered or destroyed"

Re: So you want to learn Japanese... Link | by ｢源｣ on 2006-02-24 09:15:06

I do believe she went through JET. One thing you must have found out is that Japan isn't quite as foreigner friendly as US is. I am sure that's changing slowly. There are definitely more foreign people who are walking around in Tokyo area than before, and they must have gotten there somehow. It's just that the change is slow. I'd say 2ch.net isn't a best place to ask question...I mean not just your kind of question. As you have experienced, you get undeserving flames. I suspect they feel pretty tough being anoymous. Japan still being as closed as it is, I am not surprised about racial slurr either, sadly. Sometimes it's bad enough that you get picked on just because used moved from another part of Japan (I experienced that first hand back in the day). If you are still interested in going through this after all the punishments from reality, the other way may be to look for a company in US who are interested in sending people to Japan... But note that even if you find them, there is still a good chance you'd face a stiff competition, particularly by from some one like myself (Japanese who understand both English and Japanese). Bottom line, I guess there is no easy way to do what you are trying to do, I am sorry to say... I guess I am not being much of help...

Re: So you want to learn Japanese... Link | by Filter on 2006-02-25 06:13:01

I'd really like to go to Japan to advance my language studies. But since that's not likely to be an option for me anytime soon, I'm doing the next best thing: drowning myself in Japanese media. News reports, dramas, animation, music, variety shows, etc. Admittedly, the majority of this stuff can lead to a nasty case of brain rot, but for listening comprehension practice and vocabulary acquisition, it's invaluable. Speaking of 2ch, I usually avoid that place. Too many hateful retards. The American spinoff, 4ch, is almost as bad. And congrats on passing your JLPT lvl.2 exam, Kiyote. I'm studying for the lvl.3 myself. :D ここに何を言うのか全く分からない。。。

Re: So you want to learn Japanese... Link | by on 2006-02-26 07:56:53

Filter, I agree with you about the needing to emerse yourself in the media. I live in Chicago, which has a very small Japanese population, and without the funds to get out of here, emersing myself in the media is all I can do to, which is actually how I found myself hanging out in 2ch. The rapid fire Japanese, along with the ability to copy and past kanji make it an interesting learning experience. But if you know of a board that is a little more foreigner friendly, I'd be glad to hear. As far as an anti-foreigner feelings go, what suprised me about 2ch was the directness of it all. To be honest, when I lived in Japan for a year, I have not had one single incident of any sort of prejudice. This isn't to say that I don't believe it exists, just that from my experience, in Japan, people who want to bad mouth you tend not to run up to you in the street, yet the people who are gung ho into American culture and English, do. It makes it easy to pretend that the bad stuff doesn't exist. And Minamoto, you've been a lot of help. Just talking about this helps me decide what I want to do in the upcoming year, and its always helpful to get someone who has an inside view's opinion. --theKiyote "Everything you ever loved will be altered or destroyed"

Re: So you want to learn Japanese... Link | by ｢源｣ on 2006-02-27 07:30:32

> As far as an anti-foreigner feelings go, what suprised me about > 2ch was the directness of it all. One thing about Japanese is that they don't like to be singled out so much. But when they see some one doing it (bashing you for being an American), then they'd jump in. Put anonymity to it, and they fear nothing. That's basically what you get at 2ch. But it's not limited to just there. I've had enough bad experiences over years on internet. Emersing in media is one thing, but experiencing culture is another. While I am a Japanese, I realized how "American" I am the last time I visited my family in Japan. We had a lot of conflict in our thinking processes. The worst part is that my parents still think of me as a pure Japanese, so they expect me to act the certain way. But truthfully, I've been in the State longer, so that's not how it works... Sure, I still speak the language, but obviously there is more to it if I need to fit in.

Re: So you want to learn Japanese... Link | by Shinya on 2006-03-08 22:39:32

Sou desuka. Sometimes you have to take the "American" part out of yourself when you go to Japan, because Japanese over there are different. I just got here from Japan, so I would say I'm mostly Japanese rather than Japanese-American, but I understand what you mean. For others who want to learn Japanese it's tough, but I'm sure you can be fluent if you tried hard enough.

Re: So you want to learn Japanese... Link | by ｢源｣ on 2006-03-09 09:29:03

If I can just switch back and forth like I do with speaking, it's not a problem. (Stressfull, but wouldn't be a problem) The problem for me is that I don't necessary know how to think and act like normal Japanese in many situations. Or, something my reaction is just not the same. I am pretty sure I offended my parents unintentionally, and they have done the same to me and my wife. It might not be as bad for Americans, where Japanese people will expect you to act differently. I don't get the same excuses. The fact that many Japanese people tend to dress similar to each other ("trend", I guess) doesn't help the matter much. My wife and I stand out by just walking around.

Re: So you want to learn Japanese... Link | by blue on 2006-03-12 17:26:46

WOw!! The essay definately influence me a lot! But I still wanna give Japanese a shot! It is better to know more languages. Besides eventhough you didn't master that language, at least you are better and have more advantages than those who can't understand a single word of that language!!!

Re: So you want to learn Japanese... Link | by shiroyuu on 2006-03-13 01:11:19

true. no harm learning another language, i guess. i grew up in a multi-cultural country, a society which requires knowledge (i won't say it's "fluency") in at least two languages. in some places, english has not much use even though it's the international language (it's not our national language). plus, my mother tongue's neither english nor the national language, thus i have to learn a third language in order to communicate with the relatives. on top of that, my family's japanese-educated, so, without realising, we've learnt a fourth language. the languages just came by gradually. we siblings didn't have the time to consider properly if we should learn so many languages. of course, due to the fact that we're learning so many at a time, we're not particularly excellent at any of them. this is the disadvantage. nonetheless, it makes a person easier to become the so-called "global person" if he or she is bilingual/multi-lingual. --- current favourite(s): niconico douga!!!!!

Re: So you want to learn Japanese... Link | by metapod on 2006-03-14 09:05:09

I read that essay a while ago, and it's really funny since I am a Japanese/Korean major myself. The Korean classes are all just people who want to learn Korean, but then the Japanese classes are really how the guy described. And I even had a guy in my class that wore an Evangelion shirt every day.

Re: So you want to learn Japanese... Link | by korndog on 2006-03-17 11:19:20 (edited 2006-03-17 11:20:03)

there has been some talk about anti-foreigner feelings and it made me a little curious, u see, i'm not american, but arabic. do you guys know how the japanese feel about arabs? seeing how i might go there this fall for college, i want to know what to expect :-/

Re: So you want to learn Japanese... Link | by Filter on 2006-03-17 14:20:41

Prepare to be stared at. ここに何を言うのか全く分からない。。。

Re: So you want to learn Japanese... Link | by korndog on 2006-03-19 00:58:48

lol! well, i don't mind if they stare, i don't even look like the sterotype arab, so i don't think it would be an issue for me, i was more worried about how they would feel, in other words is it a good idea to be open about it. I don't know, i might be making a big issue about it, but after all i've been though here in the states, i'm a little paranoid, heh.

Re: So you want to learn Japanese... Link | by ｢源｣ on 2006-03-20 06:44:25

I don't think people's reaction is much different, whether you are Arabic or Mexican, or white. The fact that you look different. Anyways, it's not like you can change your look to blend in, so might as well accept it if you are planning on visiting. I feel that there are a lot more acceptance of foreigners in major cities. I see definite increase in foreign people the last time I visited. However, it may not be the same if you go to smaller towns. I am a Japanese, and when I moved from one part to another, I got quite a hazing just because I was an outsider. But then again, this is when I was 10 years old. I am sure mature adults wouldn't do something like that. But let's face it, some people have that mentality, and some don't. It just depends who you happened to meet.

Re: So you want to learn Japanese... Link | by Ryu on 2006-03-23 17:16:35

i like the japanesse culture and think it would be cool to learn... i just listen to songs in japaneese and try to sing them...im ok at it lol we all learn form pain... the lone wolf walks again. pull the trigger in my soul

Re: So you want to learn Japanese... Link | by lildjnoodlegrl on 2006-07-08 17:02:17

Well yes japanese its a hard language to learn... but have u tryed to learn korean!?!?! learnign to read and write korean is harder than learning japanese!!! and have you tryed to learn how to speak Vietnamese??? its hard to learn cause if u dont say the word with the right pitch you got a totally different word!!!! and y dont you try to learn apache!??!1 all the words sould alike and can be sleared together.. although no one really speaks apache anymore, its a fun language to learn... in the apache language.. there is no such word as I, me, mine... when a japanese person see a gaijin they get a little uneast cause they have to think of the enghish they were tough in school... but when ur a gaijin speakign japanese they are a bit shocked but they respect you more than the average gaijin... yes they might find it a little funny to pick on the gaijins with some slang... the japanese are really great people they are better people than americans!!!!! that site should be deleted... あなたの思考を見なさい; それらは単語になる。 あなたの単語を見なさい; それらは行為になる。 あなたの行為を見なさい; それらは習慣になる。 あなたの習慣を見なさい; それらは特性になる。 あなたの特性を見なさい; それはあなたの運命になる。

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